M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

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kevm14
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Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by kevm14 »

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/toyota/ ... D92B17653B

Well this is surprising. The 3 does put up better numbers (aside from fuel economy) but this sets the tone for the result:
Both the 2019 Mazda3 and 2020 Toyota Corolla ride on new architectures that are stiffer and more rigid than their predecessors. In a stunning turn of events, they traded rear suspensions; the Mazda3 now has a torsion beam, and the Corolla sports a multilink setup. In SE and XSE flavors, the Corolla also comes with wider tires than the Mazda3, further hinting at a sportier direction for Toyota's venerable compact car.
With its multilink rear suspension, the Corolla handily dispatches road imperfections and doesn't get upset unless you go over something sizable. The Mazda3 does the opposite. "It doesn't really absorb the bumps like it used to," MotorTrend en Español managing editor Miguel Cortina said. "There's a bit more roll, and a few times I felt like the rear end was dancing a bit on the twisty roads whenever I ran into a small bump." On the worst streets in Los Angeles, the Mazda3's suspension crashes violently, sending a nasty jolt into the cabin and causing a loud bang upon contact.

The Toyota Corolla's handling has improved significantly; it takes corners confidently and has good high-speed stability. Light and balanced steering makes maneuvering the Corolla through tight spaces a cinch. In comparison, the Mazda3's steering is stiff and accurate, which is great on the highway but tiresome in gridlock. Although the Mazda3 possesses better body control than the Corolla, it behaves like a comfort-oriented sedan; it understeers excessively, plows into corners when you ask it to hustle, and lacks the liveliness of its predecessors. Shockingly, the Mazda3's brakes didn't inspire confidence. "The pedal feel is so off that I almost had an 'oh s***' moment while trying to brake downhill," Cortina said. "You really have to press the pedal hard to stop."
This is either a sign that Mazda is doing really bad here or that Toyota is doing really well, or perhaps some combination of both. Consider that the Corolla has the smaller, less powerful engine AND a CVT trans.
Although the Mazda3 has more power than the Corolla, it's let down by a poorly calibrated transmission. "What's going on with this six-speed tranny?" Cortina asked. "It feels very jerky at low speeds, especially when starting from a stop." Shift times are also behind competitors, even in Sport mode when the gearbox responds quicker. Cortina also criticized the 2.5-liter I-4 for feeling like the 155-hp 2.0-liter unit from his previous-generation Mazda3.

In the Corolla, Toyota's 2.0-liter I-4 pairs well with the CVT, which makes good use of the available power. "The engine and transmission offered in higher trims makes such a huge difference," senior production editor Zach Gale said. "The CVT is responsive in the city and on the highway. I'm really impressed." Downsides? It's loud at full throttle, and some may notice the transitions between the physical first gear and the belt and pulleys.
The Corolla averaged a solid 4 mpg better in all conditions, which is exactly what the EPA ratings indicated should happen. I'd argue that in this segment, 4 mpg matters. Then again as tested these cars were $29k. Is that considered cheap now?? Either way, probably never going to see a Camaro V8 for $33k if these cost $29k. They may be upper trims but are still very modest cars on the whole.
Did a Soul Swap Just Happen?

After a hard-fought battle, we declared our winner: the 2020 Toyota Corolla. How? Competitors have caught up to Mazda's once class-leading compact car. The Mazda3 has a plush interior and better build quality than the Toyota Corolla, but a finicky infotainment system, clunky powertrain, unrefined chassis, inconsistent active driver assistance tech, and a cramped interior let it down. The 2020 Toyota Corolla's fuel efficiency advantage, superior ride and handling balance, additional interior space, and a simpler multimedia interface make it the better all-around compact sedan. Extra power and a snazzy interior are nice, but they're not worth it if the rest of the vehicle doesn't deliver. Frankly, we'll take tire noise over a choppy ride and muted handling. Mazda, the most unlikely of rivals has put you on notice.
bill25
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Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:20 pm

Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by bill25 »

I read somewhere about the choice to change the rear suspension... Not good. From my experience, owning both, the 3 was way more fun to drive, but definitely has more annoying issues.

I was willing to put up with the issues for the difference in ride, but if the Corolla is better at that now, the 3 is in trouble. The Corolla needed virtually nothing. 200K, same rear brakes, original suspension. It needed a fuel pump, and a radiator w/trans lines replaced due to trans lines rotting and leaking. Really not much else. The 3 on the other hand, front lower control arms, twice, shocks and struts at like 100K, annoying issues with the front headlight with stupid spring connectors, motor mounts, stupid AC stretch belt, and currently the car is excessively shaking/vibrating, leaks some trans fluid etc.

It is sad Mazda is going cheap on these cars as the handling and nicer interior was the differential in my opinion. I don't want a CVT either... It will be interesting to see what I end up replacing the 3 with down the road. Maybe the RAV and swap the 3 to a MazdaSpeed3 setup? Probably not.

Wonder if this is part of the result of Ford leaving.
kevm14
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Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by kevm14 »

I think the interior is still supposed to be nice.
kevm14
Posts: 15813
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Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by kevm14 »

Just to close the loop. There was a 3 way comparison and the results are consistent with the other two articles.

https://www.motortrend.com/cars/honda/c ... 042B95AB3D
bill25
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Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by bill25 »

First off: In what world are people paying 28-29K for any of these?!?!?!

Mazda has the most power, but the Honda is quicker by tenths... Braking is similar. Basically, the Honda seems best at almost everything, is the cheapest (but not by much) and is the only turbo.
kevm14
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Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by kevm14 »

Yeah I agree they are all expensive. Not sure how many of these trims are selling.

I did roll my eyes when the author was describing cheap vs expensive and they have, what like $1500 between them?
Bob
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Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by Bob »

Car and Driver just did a comparison with all of the major players in this class. The Civic came out #1 overall: https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/co ... i-elantra/
kevm14
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Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by kevm14 »

You have to pay $30k to get a Mazda 3 with a manual.
bill25
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Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:20 pm

Re: M/T: Toyota Corolla vs Mazda 3

Post by bill25 »

Yikes...
with a 186-hp 2.5-liter inline-four under the hood.
I think the Mazda 3 in hatch form looks terrible.
Makes the Focus RS sound like a bargain...
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